During the Q&A, Poole answered a question from one of the masked employees. After his answer, he asked, "Did that help, Steve?" Shocked, and no doubt a bit intimidated, the employee asked how Poole knew his name. His answer: "Well, I read your name on the badge clipped to your belt."
Poole was smart and thoughtful and I was quite impressed (not just with his eye for detail). Not surprised he lasted so long at Google.
https://www.ted.com/talks/christopher_moot_poole_the_case_fo...
Is it hard to 'last' at google? I have never gotten that impression.
"Rest and Vest" is a thing.
I'm fascinated by 4chan because it is a kind of underground United Nations. It's anonymous so people around the world can express themselves - even in a way I might find horrifying - and I can get an idea of concerns people have, though they might be concerns left unsaid im polite society.
It's anonymous but your national flag is automatically assigned, and if you hide this or use a "meme flag' like a pirate flag, you will be criticized and ignored as a likely troll, trying a "false flag" operation.
4chan/pol/ is interesting, I don't know about the other boards since I don't visit them.
- Anti-vax
- Anti-gay parents
- Goose
- Ben Shapiro praise thread with a dash of anti-semitism and a whole lot of "i hope all ni**rs die"
- Praising George Floyd mural vandalism
- Anti-transgender
- Praising white nationalism/white ethnostate
- Praising 'national rape day'
- Anti-Islam
- Anti-race mixing
- Illuminati
- Celebrating police shooting blacks
- British royals news
- Anti-mask, anti-Biden
- Silver
- Anti-liberal white women as betrayers of the white race
Keep in mind I just am reading the threads in order. This is not diverse at all. Maybe 'diverse' in the sense that these white supremacists are posting from across North America and Europe. This is almost all far right white supremacist and misogynist talking points (strong overlap between the 2), almost surely disproportionately posted by young white men.
Aside from the fact that you pretty much took the bait with /pol/ there, you should take a look at their irl meetups and compare them to average reddit meetups. You would be wildly surprised by how non-white the average 4chan meetups are.
Shibboleths exist to exclude people outside the subculture stereotype - and a good way of doing that is to be offensive. Some subcultures desire to remain as subcultures.
Part of why shibboleths work is because we as a species tend to stop engaging rationally the moment we feel attacked - we switch to being defensive and actually entrench our own values further.
The 4chan shibboleth attacks everyone. No matter who you are or how you identify you're going to be debased and mocked openly - that's kind of the point.
I honestly don't know the answer to complex questions such as "should this be allowed" or things like that, I'm just glad I can discuss other things in peace and know that political discussion elsewhere can be reported and will be deleted, or even have the user banned.
Yet when people mention that they visit 4chan, they talk about the 'very clever people posting there'. It's like mentioning that you regularly go paddling in your local river in order to collect tiny nuggets of gold, without mentioning that your local river is a flow of excrement, nuclear waste, and malignant psychopaths.
Communities with no moderation at all sans removing child porn and copyrighted content (to avoid getting v8 by the feds) will always be overtaken sooner or later by the content you just listed because this sort of stuff gets driven out of communities that care about at least some decency. The exception proving the rule is r/worldpolitics, which has no rules per se but there's enough porn to drown out hate speech.
Is this something you have considered?
4chan is the same. They accept anyone from all over the world. The majority of posters are foreign. If you disagree with their narrative or political ideals, they insult you and tell you to leave. Except on 4chan you don't get banned or your life ruined for disagreeing. It's an actual safe space for ideas.
It's hilarious how similar they are.
Looks more like an international white supremacist convention than United Nations to me.
And I'm not saying that just because they love using the n-word so much, but that is one of the reasons.
Most posts on there don't seem to be from a diverse audience. They mostly seem to be from the perspective of a young racist white male audience, which is a very small percentage of the world population.
It's very obvious 4chan pol is disproportionately young white supremacist males with all the n-word, misogynist, anti-Jew obsession, white nationalism obsession that dominates the discussions.
I guarantee you the discussion/perspective there is overwhelmingly dominated by young white males with very few female perspectives (50+% of the population) and non-White perspectives (majority of the population).
All of 4chan, but especially /b/, is built around "haha just kidding ... unless", ridiculing people for getting offended while "trolling" with the most nefarious opinions and defending them "as a joke". This escalated with /pol/ which at some point became mask-off unironically white supremacist.
This is not just about 4chan being too white and too male and everybody self-identifying as NEET (whether as a joke or in earnest). The perpetual "ironic" regurgitation of racist, misogynist and anti-Semitic talking points attracted Nazis because it allowed them to hide in plain sight and they very successfully used it as part of their pipeline by getting people to repeat their jokes until they stopped laughing.
There are a lot of people on 4chan from non-European countries. I've seen vile anti-semitism expressed by someone with a Saudi flag. It's not uncommon.
Considering that we know for a fact that you don't know the ages, genders, nationality, or races of the people with these beliefs, and can only see their beliefs posted anonymously on 4chan, and then you think you have enough information to extrapolate that these people must be white, male, and young, says a lot more about YOUR prejudices than the people on 4chan, quite frankly.
You see hate and just assume the hateful are the gender, race, and age, that you perceive to be the enemy.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/001/975/547/c10...
Always fascinating how they refer to themselves.
You have n-words.
Then potato n-words for the irish (and lithuatians)
Pasta n-words for italians
Bongs for the british
Leafs for canadians
Burgers and Amerimutts
Toothpaste for the netherlands
Gypsy for hungarians and romanians (who are at a perpetual shitposting war against each other)
Hohols for the ukranians
Finngolians
The usual suspects for anyone of any asian country, extra special hate towards the chinese and Xi's internet army.
and on and on
No matter what nation of the world you are from, they will find an insult for you. It's endearing in a way really.
Oh and also there's someone shitposting from a research facility in Antarctica.
That you have to blank that out and none of the others, should tell you everything you need to know about how equal or "endearing" this is.
Bongs, Leafs, Burgers... This is all white supremacy no matter how someone tries to reframe it.
There's so many boards, each with its own culture, but people get out of it whatever bugbear they desire.
Even if it would be the worst game in the world. Cause the really normal response to and small game you don't like is to not play it and maybe write a bad review. Not what happened.
Still go back to /b/ occasionally although the flavor of that board has shifted to a more twitter-like direction that I do not favor. It remains one of the few places online where I can read shitposts with actual artistic merit. Some Facebook groups are only just now maturing to the stage where good satire exists.
I have a theory that forums mature like humans going from childhood name-calling to adult dialectics. But then again /b/ seems to be regressing so maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about.
I almost never have. On /lit/, maybe, but on /pol/ either you get no actual engagement, all the serious replies are drowned by spam and the thread necros, or one of the argumentators when called out simply stops replying or switches to shitposting.
You can sometimes have a good argument to completion, but it's very rare. Unless the argument is something the 4chan hive finds uncontroversial or is empathetic to.
I've spent a fair amount of time on 4chan/pol/
for over a decade and my opinion is moot is a
decent guy who sold it after he tried to reign
in GamerGate and was loudly criticized on the
site for it. I don't think Google would have
hired him if it weren't for that redeeming quality.
Some private pictures were taken from a user's account on my old site, and published to 4chan circa 2007. Chris was very sympathetic and was eager to help take the pics down and/or find the culprit.
Even though parts of 4ch turned into an absolute cesspool, that is not who moot is. He simply created an anonymous free-speech platform.
Most of the other boards hate /pol/ by the way and “Go back to /pol/.” is commonly heard elsewhere, which shows the differing views.
That's an interesting point. How do you tell if something is a real concern that is left unsaid vs just a fake concern? Or the difference between a concern that is quite prevalent vs a concern that is just being astroturfed?
Especially when you consider how anonymous and the occupy movements were all the rage among woke leftists a few years back, and they originated from 4chan.
People don’t spend 9 days creating the perfect YTMND thing because they can spend that time on Instagram, YouTube or whatever in pursuit of enough fame to create a career out of it.
The only reason we still have so many memes and so many (less than an A4 page) blog posts is because of how little effort it requires with modern tech.
I think 4chan is actually one of the places that has changed the least. I mean, /b/ without talented users is just 100% shit instead of only being 99% shit, but /tg/ is exactly the way I left it a decade ago.
Actually we should already have changed it - that's standard practice when one article cribs from another. But I missed it in this case.
Meanwhile I've been at 4 startups, from seed to Series B . I just get bored so easy.. after 3 or so years I NEED a change. Or maybe is because startups dont care about w/l balance and drain you until you quit.
I've never worked anywhere where people were much use before 2-3 years in harness. Too much domain knowledge maybe.
A lot of the time it may be warranted. But just as often, like in this article, it definitely is not.
I mean imagine if Facebook had the option to be anonymous somehow on their platform and called everyone Unnamed who hadn't finished their registration or didn't want to.
You'd see Unnamed responsible for nation-state sponsored terrorism and manipulating the votes of other countries. What a joke.
Eventually they moved beyond fun, simple little social causes to more seriously disruptive and economically/politically dangerous stuff, and at that point, not surprisingly, the alphabet agencies slipped in and broke up the party.
DDoS attacks as well as actual hacks were performed in the name of 'Anonymous', and at the time of the Stratfor hack, various LulzSec members were already in their late twenties...
I don't think it's fair to say this without clarifying that a lot of the Q and other deranged stuff started happening after moot left. Nor is Pepe really a recent meme (somewhere I have Pepes saved from like the mid '00s), nor is Anonymous really a group (but that's questionable and a debate that isn't really relevant)... I know there's very little expectations when it comes to reporting on web subcultures but come on, this is common knowledge (maybe that's why it isn't clarified?).
It's pretty interesting, because as long as I've been conscious on the Internet it's always been posed as an 'inaccessible cult.' Probably due to all the inside jokes, I guess?
That's true on a technical level only. But culture matters.
Attitudes like yours were why 4chan was such a surprise to the rest of us. The culture that we all thought was just "ironic" and "edgy" with its casual racism turned out to be... kinda actually racist when right wingers decided to weaponize xenophobia and bigotry. The groupthink of a bunch of almost-exclusively-male incels turned out to be hiding genuine misogyny once they had an enemy to point themselves at in gamergate.
Culture matters. Being an "open website" just describes how it happens, not why.
To you and I, maybe! But even arstechnica's readership may not be aware of all this stuff.
Media reporting on internet communities, or places that I physically live in that I've seen are invariably very inaccurate.
Propaganda to teach that anything free is dirty/salacious to keep people in their walled gardens.
There was an article in Motherboard[1] how /pol/ is being idealogically driven due to moderation choices. I don't believe moot would have allowed such an ideologically driven moderation changes to continue for so long. (IIRC, moot had deleted /pol/ twice, once as /n/ which he removed for being too much like stormfront).
[1] https://www.vice.com/en/article/m7aap8/the-man-who-helped-tu...
Yes. This is an extraordinary business case for strategic HCM discussions.
I never try to take for granted when I'm involved in artists' spaces, FOSS projects, hacker spaces, etc. The point is to continue a cycle of learning and contributing back, not consume until all the resources are sucked dry...
On the one hand, no one would blame him for just continuing to drift off into obscurity. On the other, he's a smart guy, and smart guys tend to be restless. Add to this that the hurricane of anti-trust lawsuits happening right now may result in a re-shuffling of the deck when it comes to the landscape of the web in a few years, and there's some real potential for new projects on the world-wide information superhighway, in a way there hasn't been in some time.
Just want to say you did a good job, thanks for being you and doing your thing. I know it's been tough and all, so thanks for the hard work.
Dunno about google maps though, that seemed to have taken a dive since ~2013. Maybe look into biotech and that jazz, it needs people like you.
Still, be good to see what you're doing next. Keep up that hard work and effort, it shows.
like literally what is the point of this to lead people to talk about unrelated aspects of 4chan and maybe how that influenced his time at Google
but the article describes an extremely normal and extremely extended time at Google
what...?
Lol such a dishonest representation of FANG employment. Well above average (2 years) a year past the vesting cliff, and about average in terms of team switches
That spin had so much torque I'm surprised the article stayed motionless.
This is sort of misleading. The 2 year quote often thrown around is a measure of the average tenure of current employees at the company, not a measure of the average tenure of people leaving.
I like to note that a company with exponential growth (and all of the major tech firms, excepting perhaps microsoft since it's been around longer count here) can have a seemingly low tenure by that first metric even if no one has ever left the company.
How he avoid cancel culture is beyond me