State Charges 77-Year-Old for 'Practicing Engineering Without a License' (opens in new tab)

(vice.com)

25 pointsmkoc4y ago26 comments

26 comments

A similar case happened last year with an unlicensed engineer who composed a public paper vindicating his wife in an alleged traffic stop violation.

Source:https://reason.com/2020/03/02/oregon-tried-to-silence-this-e...

airhead9694y ago

IJ also helped here.

https://ij.org/press-release/oregon-engineer-wins-traffic-li...

totalZero4y ago

Seems like a clear violation of the First Amendment to use the force of law to prohibit a person from speaking an opinion.

hytdstd4y ago

Not to me. He acted as an engineering consultant or manager in the courtroom. Managers and consultants on engineering projects rightfully require licenses, even if they do nothing but talk in meetings.

JoshuaAshton4y ago

So you should be required to go through a government licensing programme to be able to tell the government they fucked up? :D

1 more reply

agency4y ago

“All professions are conspiracies against the laity.”

- George Bernard Shaw

villgax4y ago

Lol, software engineering would not be where it is if not for tinkerers.

tomerv4y ago

Right, but this is about civil engineering. I suppose that field also had tinkerers at some point, but today we expect civil engineers to have a diploma and license. Maybe software engineering will go that way too in the future, after the Internet of Unsecured Things finally implodes.

airhead9694y ago

I know of a civil engineer PE who is an expert in code interpretations of the ASME (not ASCE) boilers and pressure vessels (BPVC) codes. He acts as an expert witness and also makes interpretations for clients who are unsure about the code's meaning. He makes millions because the correct design and use of such items affect lives and property at immense scales.

Safety regulations are written in blood that is too easily washed-off.

airhead9694y ago

CE's play with mud. They can go to the beach, get some LEGO, or build a bridge of stones across a brook.

;-))

There are plenty of ways for CE's to "tinker" using civil and mechanical engineering statics and dynamics simulators.

airhead9694y ago

There is always a space for tinkering. I took apart clocks and small appliances when I was 5. Eventually, my dad had me rebuilding carburetors using the kits because I wasn't strong enough to rebuild alternators yet.

Last month, I made Alexa-enabled "tea candle" lanterns by gutting WiFi bedside lights and using privacy paint on said lanterns. As diffusers, I reshaped the diffusers from the original lights. Where the circuit boards appear, I painted the back walls and PCBs matte black to hide them when the lights are on. I dremeled slots in the lantern bases for USB power.

What appears to be happening is the over-regulation of title combinations to collect more money by "solving" a professionalization problem that didn't need solving.

PE is good enough.

wdb4y ago

Do you need a license to be a software engineer? Sounds like its a protected title like in some other countries

leipert4y ago

In a lot of countries “Engineer” is a protected title. (Same in Germany where “Ingenieur” is protected). The term is usually used for mechanical engineers, and the like. Jobs you can only do with a degree, because if you fail, lives could be at stake.

We actually had a Canadian colleague request to change the job title in the employment from Software Engineer to Software Developer due to these restrictions.

airhead9694y ago

That's asinine when there is no associated professional licensure requirement for cobbling together HTML for a mom&pop liquor store.

In the US, any type of (non-locomotive) engineer involved in critical engineering design, decisions, implementation, and manufacturing of large-scale or life-safety aspects can or should be a "professional engineer" (PE) so malpractice insurance (EPLI) will cover them and client/employers will hire them.

If I say I'm a witch doctor, there is no confusion that I'm not a doctor (of medicine).

My undergrad major was Computer Science & Engineering. Do I need an extra certificate to call myself "an engineer?" Nope.

1 more reply

eschaton4y ago

Opinions and jurisdictions differ. The problem is that some jurisdiction might define “software engineering” such that an individual without a license (and not under supervision of someone with one) could get in trouble for doing software development rather than describing themselves as an engineer.

This is actually something some people want. Don’t let them achieve it.

ranguna4y ago

At least not in Portugal, you can work as a software developer even without going to school.

enjoyyourlife4y ago

That doesn't necessarily mean that you can testify in court as a professional software developer without going to school

1 more reply

airhead9694y ago

In the US, there are a dozen or so legally-protected "engineer" title variants and professional designations like "professional engineer" (PE). My degree is accredited for the path of PE, but I would need a reason to go that route.

If it's unlisted, then it's fair to use by anyone:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_professional_designati...

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

26 comments

Dracophoenix4y ago

A similar case happened last year with an unlicensed engineer who composed a public paper vindicating his wife in an alleged traffic stop violation.

Source:https://reason.com/2020/03/02/oregon-tried-to-silence-this-e...

airhead9694y ago

IJ also helped here.

https://ij.org/press-release/oregon-engineer-wins-traffic-li...

totalZero4y ago

Seems like a clear violation of the First Amendment to use the force of law to prohibit a person from speaking an opinion.

hytdstd4y ago

JoshuaAshton4y ago

So you should be required to go through a government licensing programme to be able to tell the government they fucked up? :D

1 more reply

agency4y ago

“All professions are conspiracies against the laity.”

- George Bernard Shaw

villgax4y ago

Lol, software engineering would not be where it is if not for tinkerers.

tomerv4y ago

airhead9694y ago

Safety regulations are written in blood that is too easily washed-off.

airhead9694y ago

CE's play with mud. They can go to the beach, get some LEGO, or build a bridge of stones across a brook.

;-))

There are plenty of ways for CE's to "tinker" using civil and mechanical engineering statics and dynamics simulators.

airhead9694y ago

What appears to be happening is the over-regulation of title combinations to collect more money by "solving" a professionalization problem that didn't need solving.

PE is good enough.

wdb4y ago

Do you need a license to be a software engineer? Sounds like its a protected title like in some other countries

leipert4y ago

We actually had a Canadian colleague request to change the job title in the employment from Software Engineer to Software Developer due to these restrictions.

airhead9694y ago

That's asinine when there is no associated professional licensure requirement for cobbling together HTML for a mom&pop liquor store.

If I say I'm a witch doctor, there is no confusion that I'm not a doctor (of medicine).

My undergrad major was Computer Science & Engineering. Do I need an extra certificate to call myself "an engineer?" Nope.

1 more reply

eschaton4y ago

This is actually something some people want. Don’t let them achieve it.

ranguna4y ago

At least not in Portugal, you can work as a software developer even without going to school.

enjoyyourlife4y ago

That doesn't necessarily mean that you can testify in court as a professional software developer without going to school

1 more reply

airhead9694y ago

If it's unlisted, then it's fair to use by anyone:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_professional_designati...

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse