undefined | Better HN

0 pointsonion2k11y ago0 comments

Why shouldn't they go after sites that cause them to lose profit?

You'll need to provide evidence that downloading actually leads to lower profits before anyone can tackle that question.

The hypothesis that "People who download content buy less because they're getting TV shows for free. If they couldn't download they'd buy instead." might sound fine, there are some problems with it.

* People might be spending 100% of their entertainment budget on TV shows already, so they couldn't buy any more if they stopped downloading. Stopping those downloads would lead to zero additional profit.

* People might be downloading everything regardless of what it is, including a hell of a lot of things they'd never buy (hoarding mentality). Stopping those downloads would lead to zero additional profit.

* People who download might be fanatical about the TV show, downloading shows to watch as early as possible. Stopping those downloads would lead have a negative impact on profit because those are the people who do the grass-roots evangelism that drives hype.

* People download because they believe the content has zero value. Without downloads they'd just watch something else. Stopping those downloads would lead to zero additional profit.

The question of whether downloading actually harms industry or not had not been answered.

0 comments

8 comments · 3 top-level

SnacksOnAPlane11y ago· 4 in thread

> The question of whether downloading actually harms industry or not had not been answered.

This is kind of ridiculous. I think we all know that it hurts the industry. Only in your third scenario does downloading actually help the content producers. And you're leaving off two groups that hurt your case:

* people who would watch the show on TV but instead download

* people who would buy DVDs but instead download

Based on people I know who torrent, the second group is actually fairly large.

Your argument is like "people who go into a store and steal a DVD shouldn't get in trouble because they probably wouldn't have bought that DVD anyway." Which is clearly a ridiculous argument.

philbarr11y ago

> Your argument is like "people who go into a store and steal a DVD shouldn't get in trouble because they probably wouldn't have bought that DVD anyway."

It's not quite the same as saying that. It's more like, "people who go into a store and steal a DVD shouldn't get in trouble because they probably wouldn't have bought that DVD anyway and the way they're stealing it means the store has exactly the same number of DVDs as it did before the theft."

SnacksOnAPlane11y ago

The cost of producing the DVD is close to nothing. It's not like stealing a physically hard-to-produce object. You're paying for the IP.

DVDs don't operate in a scarcity model. Stealing a DVD really is almost equivalent to pirating a movie. The fact that the store is deprived of a physical item is pretty much irrelevant to the argument; they probably would have disposed of many unsold copies of the DVD anyway.

onion2kOP11y ago

The "copyright infringement is theft" argument has been thoroughly debunked. It's not even remotely similar. Theft is depriving someone of property. No one is deprived of anything when you copy something, and downloads aren't property.

SnacksOnAPlane11y ago

It's absolutely similar. It's getting something without paying for it. The "deprived of property" thing is kind of a red herring anyway, since the cost to make an additional DVD is close to nothing, and stores routinely dispose of unsold merchandise, often ordering more than they think they'll sell so there's no risk of selling out.

watty11y ago· 1 in thread

Let's say it doesn't have any affect on their profits... hell, lets say piracy makes everyone MORE money. Does it matter? Shouldn't content creators still have a right to say who gets their content for free?

onion2kOP11y ago

Shouldn't content creators still have a right to say who gets their content for free?

Of course. But if they want to have that say then they should do whatever they can to protect their work. If they fail to protect their content and let someone upload it then that's their fault. It's not my place as a consumer to help them to protect their work by not downloading it. Morally speaking I have no duty to help the content creator.

StavrosK11y ago

* People are willing to pay for content, but there's no easy/practical way for them to do so. Without downloads, they just wouldn't watch the thing at all.

I suspect this is the most frequent camp, and it's the one I'm in. If you want to take my money, downloads are irrelevant, just allow Netflix to have better stuff.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

8 comments · 3 top-level

SnacksOnAPlane11y ago· 4 in thread

> The question of whether downloading actually harms industry or not had not been answered.

* people who would watch the show on TV but instead download

* people who would buy DVDs but instead download

Based on people I know who torrent, the second group is actually fairly large.

Your argument is like "people who go into a store and steal a DVD shouldn't get in trouble because they probably wouldn't have bought that DVD anyway." Which is clearly a ridiculous argument.

philbarr11y ago

> Your argument is like "people who go into a store and steal a DVD shouldn't get in trouble because they probably wouldn't have bought that DVD anyway."

SnacksOnAPlane11y ago

The cost of producing the DVD is close to nothing. It's not like stealing a physically hard-to-produce object. You're paying for the IP.

onion2kOP11y ago

SnacksOnAPlane11y ago

watty11y ago· 1 in thread

onion2kOP11y ago

Shouldn't content creators still have a right to say who gets their content for free?

StavrosK11y ago

* People are willing to pay for content, but there's no easy/practical way for them to do so. Without downloads, they just wouldn't watch the thing at all.

I suspect this is the most frequent camp, and it's the one I'm in. If you want to take my money, downloads are irrelevant, just allow Netflix to have better stuff.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse