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0 pointsrtpg11y ago0 comments

There are use cases where you need the choice, but most people do not need the choice.

Most programs written in the real world (enterprise-y Java apps) do not need strong control on GC, choice of integer types, or many other things offered to them. Reducing choice will increase code/tool quality.

I think that we should make the uncommon choice reallllly hard to put into place. Make it a pain to configure the GC, give specific integer types really long names. Just stop people from premature optimization and leave these tools to people who know what they're doing.

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7 comments · 2 top-level

danbruc11y ago· 5 in thread

If you are unable to make good decision between different number types you better don't write software, IMHO. How do you reason about the operations you apply to your data if you are ignorant of the possible values?

coldtea11y ago

>If you are unable to make good decision between different number types you better don't write software, IMHO.

Doesn't sound very humble, this "HO".

Do you know how many programmers that run circles around you (and me) have done mistakes similar to what Doug describes?

danbruc11y ago

Being able to make good decisions does not guarantee you will never make a mistake. And he even explains his reasoning behind his choice and it was a justifiable decision when he made it. But I stand by what I said - if you are unable to decide between using 8 bit or 64 bit integers or a floating point type or a decimal type you should not be a professional software developer because it is really a very basic and fundamental skill.

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rtpgOP11y ago

I write software, and the amount of times I even have to explicitly manipulate numbers in a given week is very close to zero. Even iteration is done through iterators instead of indexes, so writing a plus sign is done pretty sparingly.

Data manipulation beyond "pull out of database" or "submit user input to database" is a lot rarer in enterprise software like this than in scientific computing. I'm not saying it's bad to be aware of it, but software is more than numbers.

danbruc11y ago

I develop enterprise software, too, and I definitely think it matters there, too. You better make sure your database columns have the correct number type or you will get in trouble if your inventory numbers or monetary values start showing rounding errors.

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cbhl11y ago

Even if you abstract away the indexes, when working with datasets that large you have to worry about whether the standard implementation makes the same class of error.

For example, using Java's binarySearch on arrays of length over 2^30 was broken until 2006[0][1].

[0]: http://googleresearch.blogspot.com/2006/06/extra-extra-read-...

[1]: http://bugs.java.com/bugdatabase/view_bug.do?bug_id=5045582

TeMPOraL11y ago

I guess that most programming languages, with possible exception of COBOL, were not created with boring stuff - like enterprise-y apps or webdev, that compose most of the programming today - in mind.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

7 comments · 2 top-level

danbruc11y ago· 5 in thread

coldtea11y ago

>If you are unable to make good decision between different number types you better don't write software, IMHO.

Doesn't sound very humble, this "HO".

Do you know how many programmers that run circles around you (and me) have done mistakes similar to what Doug describes?

danbruc11y ago

2 more replies

rtpgOP11y ago

danbruc11y ago

2 more replies

cbhl11y ago

Even if you abstract away the indexes, when working with datasets that large you have to worry about whether the standard implementation makes the same class of error.

For example, using Java's binarySearch on arrays of length over 2^30 was broken until 2006[0][1].

[0]: http://googleresearch.blogspot.com/2006/06/extra-extra-read-...

[1]: http://bugs.java.com/bugdatabase/view_bug.do?bug_id=5045582

TeMPOraL11y ago

I guess that most programming languages, with possible exception of COBOL, were not created with boring stuff - like enterprise-y apps or webdev, that compose most of the programming today - in mind.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse