>God is Public spending, the clergé is the public workers that pay no taxes and get to retire early with big salaries and lots of privileges and the Tiers état is the people paying for the rest. http://leblogalupus.com/2013/10/09/charles-gave-la-france-es...

Yep, because as any Friedman loving economist (like Charles Gave you're linking to) will tell you, there's only one God and it's the Market.

>So one of the best doctors is paid 21€ and 7.5€?

No, you see, that's the thing about Social Security (you seem to know so much about), that's what the OP paid, the rest was paid to the doctor by the Social Security. This is well documented in http://www.securite-sociale.info/ you should take a look.

>See, this is where we disagree. It is my company, my private property. I should be able to do as I please with it as long as don't mess with other's freedom, this is a constitutional right in the declaration of human rights, private property is sacred.

"There is just one God, and it's private property". Where did you find "private property is sacred" anywhere in the declaration of human rights?

>Are you serious? The richest man in France has left and many of the top richest famillies have left: LVMH, Lacoste, Peugeot etc.

Yep and Apple, Google et al. don't pay any corporate taxes. Surely, the problem is the taxes.

> It is my company, my private property. I should be able to do as I please with it as long as don't mess with other's freedom, this is a constitutional right in the declaration of human rights, private property is sacred.

No you should not, and no, that's really not what the declaration of human rights is about.

When you create a french company your create a “personne morale”, a legal entity, an entity on its own, that is viewed more like a living entity and not like an inanimate object. You do have rights on this entity, but you do also have obligations, not the least of which is to follow the law.

So no, just because you want to you can't employ underage kids for instance.

And just because you want, you can't just fire people at will without reasons.

One could argue that laws could be improved, but that's really not the point you're making.

First, you need to decide if the taxes on the salary are paid by the company or by the employee (I believe it's by the employee, since (s)he is a priori the one who do the work creating this wealth), you can't count them twice as you are doing here, it is dishonest reasoning.

Your computation is wrong, because if you make 2000€/month, your taxes on income are closer to 10% than to 30%. Also, I (and many other people), don't see the "charges" (taxes taken on the salary before it is paid to the employee) as a taxes such as the one on incomes because it pays for good and free public school, good and free universities, good and free hospitals, retirement and unemployment systems… If you take all that into account in the computation, it's actually a big win for everyone. Maybe it is not the case for a few exceptions of very rich people who would be even richer, but what's the point of that?

Sorry for being rude, I read your first post as quite rude and was reacting in the heat of the moment.

This government doesn't have anwser to everything, and their answer is not generally "more tax". On the contrary I find that a lot a gifts are made to companies in "crédit d'impôt".

No the doctor is not paid 21€ and 7.5€, that is the point, actually. What I told is not an anecdotal evidence, it is the general rule. If you say the opposite you are either lying or you don't know what you are talking about. The only thing that are not well reimbursed by the Sécurité Sociale is optical and dental, but mutuelles (semi-private or private insurance) are quite good for this.

Also, the website you link about the Sécurité Sociale is pure propaganda.

We agree on one thing here: we are totally disagreeing on what are your rights as a company owner.

Your analogy with god, clergé, tiers-états, etc. is wrong. "the clergé is the public workers that pay no taxes and get to retire early with big salaries". Really? Have you looked at the salary of professor and researcher in France compared to those of engineer in the industry? Do you really live in France?

Concerning the richests:

LVMH: the company is still based in France. Bernard Arnault (who is the 10th worldwide richest man) is still French.

Lacoste: the company is still based in France. José Luis Duran is still French, René Lacoste was too until his death.

Peugeot: the company is still based in France. Philippe Varin is still French. I'm not sure about Thierry Peugeot, maybe you are right and he left.

Other than that, Iliad, Auchan, Dassault, L'Oréal, Hermes, Bollore, Pernod Ricard… I don't see any movements in the French top 30 richest people/company in the past decade.

Now, it's true that they cheat with their taxes, but it's not right and maybe if those big companies, rich person participated fairly to the society effort there would be less taxes on smaller companies…