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0 pointsdurandal16d ago0 comments

The only fair way to compare the cost to solar and wind, is if wind and solar producers would have to make power guarantees 24/7 and cover the cost of the production gaps (hint: this makes solar and wind very expensive).

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5 comments · 2 top-level

Matumio6d ago· 3 in thread

Not sure if that's fair. Sometimes the sun actually does shine, and while you won't get rich selling energy during that time, having electricity available essentially for free during some of the peak hours is worth something. Someone will eventually find a use for free energy. If nothing else, at least we can turn off all coal, gas and oil plants while the sun shines.

WalterBright6d ago

> we can turn off all coal, gas and oil plants while the sun shines.

Those plants are not designed to be turned on and off, and both must be done gradually and carefully to avoid cracking the turbines.

crote6d ago

Gas peaker plants are designed to be turned on and off regularly. They can go from cold shutdown to full load in less than an hour, with some able to do it in less than 10 minutes[0].

A decent bunch of that is going to be sheer inertia as you have to spin up a heavy chunk of metal. Keep that rotating (which is actually a good thing in renewable-heavy grids!) and it can be done even faster. Similarly, keeping some parts warm costs very little energy and allows even faster ramp=up.

But that's actually not relevant because battery storage is far more attractive for that kind of short-term demand. The renewable grid will need gas plants which can fill in the gap left when it is both dark and wind-less - which due to meteorology is trivially known 72 hours in advance, leaving plenty of time to prepare the plant for use.

[0]: https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=45956

dalyons5d ago

And I’m supposed to care? Old tech will be pushed off the grid by cheap renewables, and rapid dispatch gas will remain. Sounds great.

m1016d ago

If only that were not just the start of the issue. Regulation means nuclear is probably an order of magnitude more expensive than it could be.

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