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0 pointssteve19771mo ago0 comments

I mean Cocoa and SwiftUI are more consistent in the sense that a lot of stuff automatically adapts when Apple changes styling. And they certainly have less churn and more focus compared to Microsoft.

Basically it's been Objective-C and Cocoa since around 2000, later on Swift and then also SwiftUI. That's not too bad for 25 years.

And in contrast to MS, you didn't get abandoned when you were sticking to the official frameworks. Quite contrary, you basically got the switches from PowerPC to x86 to ARM almost for free for example.

Apple is not perfect by any means, but in this regard I truly think they are ahead of Microsoft.

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pjmlp1mo ago

Sure, if we ignore the stuff and bugs they still have, the missing features in SwiftUI and performance regressions, or the iPhonisms brought to macOS with Catalyst.

The reboot of frameworks based in OpenGL with the Metal rewrite.

And many other things I am not bothering with since all those OS System N releases, A/UX UI framework, Teligent based documents,....

noodletheworld1mo ago

Come on, you think SwiftUI has more bugs than the ten different Microsoft frameworks?

There are just more people encountering them because the developers are concentrated on using one thing.

It’s not perfect, but a compared to Microsoft, calling Apple out for having bugs is a little rich isn't it?

I pose to you, if the Microsoft offerings are so compelling, why are the serious players using 3rd party wrappers like QT and Avalonia?

It’s because the first party offerings are not compelling. They’re a disaster dumpster fire. And buggy.

pjmlp1mo ago

If Apple products are so compelling why are so many devs using Electron, React Native and Flutter on macOS, to the point it deserved being mentioned at WWDC 2025 State of the Nation Keynote?

My point was don't throw stones when having a big glass roof as well.

Apple isn't the perfection you make out to be, also has a rich history of failures, and only did not went bankrupt due to sheer luck of doing the right decision when there were not many remaining to take.

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pjmlp1mo ago

Sure, if we ignore the stuff and bugs they still have, the missing features in SwiftUI and performance regressions, or the iPhonisms brought to macOS with Catalyst.

The reboot of frameworks based in OpenGL with the Metal rewrite.

And many other things I am not bothering with since all those OS System N releases, A/UX UI framework, Teligent based documents,....

noodletheworld1mo ago

Come on, you think SwiftUI has more bugs than the ten different Microsoft frameworks?

There are just more people encountering them because the developers are concentrated on using one thing.

It’s not perfect, but a compared to Microsoft, calling Apple out for having bugs is a little rich isn't it?

I pose to you, if the Microsoft offerings are so compelling, why are the serious players using 3rd party wrappers like QT and Avalonia?

It’s because the first party offerings are not compelling. They’re a disaster dumpster fire. And buggy.

pjmlp1mo ago

If Apple products are so compelling why are so many devs using Electron, React Native and Flutter on macOS, to the point it deserved being mentioned at WWDC 2025 State of the Nation Keynote?

My point was don't throw stones when having a big glass roof as well.

4 more replies

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