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0 pointsSayrus1mo ago0 comments

I keep hearing this one. But at least for EU, the eCall system requires external communication to be disabled until activated during serious accident. It cannot be used for tracking the vehicle in real-time.

Some parts of the legislation (https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32...):

> 2. The personal data processed pursuant to this Regulation shall only be used for the purpose of handling the emergency situations referred to in the first subparagraph of Article 5(2).

> Manufacturers shall provide clear and comprehensive information in the owner's manual about the processing of data carried out through the 112-based eCall in-vehicle system. That information shall consist of:

> the fact that there is no constant tracking of the vehicle;

That vehicle nowadays are equipped with always-on internet and microphones is not related to remote assistance.

0 comments

SV_BubbleTime1mo ago

This is such misdirection.

Your car if new enough, IS reporting its diagnostics including GPS via cell. All the time. This isn’t exactly personally identifiable so they get away with it just fine.

This is unrelated to the microphones and assistance systems.

cluckindan1mo ago

It becomes personally identifiable through correlations with other datasets.

That is the kind of thing people allow when they click accept or decline on those pesky ”we and our 195735 partners would like to…” dialogs.

SayrusOP1mo ago

Which is exactly my point. Cars are reporting on you, but tying that to remote assistance is disingenuous.

2 more replies

nunobrito1mo ago

Kindly read point number 2 slowly.

There are two definitions: a) Personal Data and b) Emergency Situations

What is an emergency situation and how can a car determine it is one? These are "smart" cars which aren't nowadays smart enough to process all your data locally, so that data is sent to servers elsewhere which process if either points a) or b) apply.

It is your choice to believe that voice data is ever deleted once acquired by governments and entities thirsty to benefit from that information.

For security experts this is just another "I told you so" within a few years.

SayrusOP1mo ago

Emergency situations are defined by two situations: severe accidents and manual press of the button. Article 6 covers the data being sent, Article 5 covers the manufacturer's obligations. Your audio during the accident and your last three locations may leak, but the eCall system is not designed for a permanent phone-home system. If I remember correctly, you can't even use the eCall SIM for tracking as that'd encourage people to disable safety features.

All the things you are talking about, permanent phone-home, tracking of location, audio and video, driving habits, are tracked, sent and resold. That's what smart cars do. But it is not done through the eCall system. See it from the company perspective: why would they risk penalties for non-compliance when they can gather and resell all personal data with no risks using their own system instead of a safety one?

nunobrito1mo ago

That is assuming the eCall system is used at all.

I stated that the microphone and network access installed on modern car for emergency situations can and will be used 24/7 when deemed "necessary" for your "security".

Different things, same hardware.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

SV_BubbleTime1mo ago

This is such misdirection.

Your car if new enough, IS reporting its diagnostics including GPS via cell. All the time. This isn’t exactly personally identifiable so they get away with it just fine.

This is unrelated to the microphones and assistance systems.

cluckindan1mo ago

It becomes personally identifiable through correlations with other datasets.

That is the kind of thing people allow when they click accept or decline on those pesky ”we and our 195735 partners would like to…” dialogs.

SayrusOP1mo ago

Which is exactly my point. Cars are reporting on you, but tying that to remote assistance is disingenuous.

2 more replies

nunobrito1mo ago

Kindly read point number 2 slowly.

There are two definitions: a) Personal Data and b) Emergency Situations

It is your choice to believe that voice data is ever deleted once acquired by governments and entities thirsty to benefit from that information.

For security experts this is just another "I told you so" within a few years.

SayrusOP1mo ago

nunobrito1mo ago

That is assuming the eCall system is used at all.

I stated that the microphone and network access installed on modern car for emergency situations can and will be used 24/7 when deemed "necessary" for your "security".

Different things, same hardware.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse