undefined | Better HN

0 pointspjmlp5mo ago0 comments

They are badly copied Ant build files.

Ant came first, then when Microsoft redid the VS project format, they created MSBuild.

As incredible as it may sound, Ant is still easier to deal with than MSBuild.

0 comments

Ant did not include IF THEN ELSE, unless you added the contrib package.

If you understood the paradigm, you could write branches in Ant files simply using properties and guards on properties ("unless"). Using IF in Ant was basically admission of not having understood Ant.

This said, I used Ant for a very limited amount of time.

pjmlpOP5mo ago

It sure did, you use conditions, no need for contrib.

https://ant.apache.org/manual/Tasks/condition.html

The else part is easily done by repeating and negating the condition.

Two other advantages of Ant that MSBuild lacks in a sane way to this day, are macros, and proper documentation.

bokchoi5mo ago

As of Ant 1.9.1, you can use 'if' and 'unless' attributes on any task or element in a target. I stopped using Ant a long time ago, but this was a pleasant discovery when I had to pick up an old Ant based project recently.

https://ant.apache.org/manual/ifunless.html

giamma5mo ago

I agree, that is what I meant: there were people who installed Contrib to have <if> element, but in reality you did not need that you could just use Ant's built-in features like you said. In my opinion installing Contrib to use <if> was a demonstration of not having understood how Ant works.

pjmlpOP5mo ago

Nice, I was basing my answer on what was there initially.

I always liked Ant, as I don't suffer from XML allergy.

mrsmrtss5mo ago

The legacy version of MSBuild was really bad, but the modern MSBuild project files for .NET are actually quite concise and clean by default?

pjmlpOP5mo ago

Only if you are happy with defaults and don't require any build logic.

Also you forgot MSBuild is used for everything, not only .NET.

mrsmrtss5mo ago

For new .NET SDK style projects you hardly ever need to customize the defaults and I know it's used for more stuff than .NET, but I just wanted to give an example where it actually doesn't suck. Also, you may not need to do everything in MSBuild, for some more complex stuff, you can use something like Cake (https://cakebuild.net/) in .NET for example and skip the programming in XML.

pjmlpOP5mo ago

.NET made into my toolbox before it was announced to the world, thanks to be working at a MSFT partner that was selected to be part of the Portuguese launch event for .NET with ready made products.

Never seen any big corp using alternative .NET build tools, rather wrestling MSBuild, or before it came to be, nmake.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

giamma5mo ago

Ant did not include IF THEN ELSE, unless you added the contrib package.

This said, I used Ant for a very limited amount of time.

pjmlpOP5mo ago

It sure did, you use conditions, no need for contrib.

https://ant.apache.org/manual/Tasks/condition.html

The else part is easily done by repeating and negating the condition.

Two other advantages of Ant that MSBuild lacks in a sane way to this day, are macros, and proper documentation.

bokchoi5mo ago

https://ant.apache.org/manual/ifunless.html

giamma5mo ago

pjmlpOP5mo ago

Nice, I was basing my answer on what was there initially.

I always liked Ant, as I don't suffer from XML allergy.

mrsmrtss5mo ago

The legacy version of MSBuild was really bad, but the modern MSBuild project files for .NET are actually quite concise and clean by default?

pjmlpOP5mo ago

Only if you are happy with defaults and don't require any build logic.

Also you forgot MSBuild is used for everything, not only .NET.

mrsmrtss5mo ago

pjmlpOP5mo ago

.NET made into my toolbox before it was announced to the world, thanks to be working at a MSFT partner that was selected to be part of the Portuguese launch event for .NET with ready made products.

Never seen any big corp using alternative .NET build tools, rather wrestling MSBuild, or before it came to be, nmake.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse