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0 pointsFirmwareBurner7mo ago0 comments

Sorry I don't buy it. Which examples are there of academics going against the government policies and still keeping their jobs and funds?

I lived in Germany and the moment you don't do what the government says you get the full shaft. Nobody let's you rebel against the government with no consequences, not in US, not in Germany, not in UK, nowhere.

People painting Germany like a bastion of free speech are coping hard. Only if you consider free speech doing and saying only what the government says.

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A_D_E_P_T7mo ago

It's hard to prove a negative. Can you show us an example of anything like what's happening at UCLA (collective punishment of an entire institution) or an example of an individual professor being harshly penalized or sanctioned for expressing personal political opinions?

FirmwareBurnerOP7mo ago

Don't spin this around, what I asked you is not a negative.

People here argued that the US is fascist because in academia you can't get away with breaking governments rules getting you defunded and pointing at Germany for being superior in this regard.

So then I asked for proof that in other countries you can get away in academia with breaking the government's rules and not get defunded. It really is that simple.

davrosthedalek7mo ago

That's not what people have complained about. People complained about that in the US a government rule seems to be "don't criticize the government".

What about Christian Drosten who criticized a lot of the Corona decisions, Jan Boehmermann who is very critical but still employed by state-financed TV. Fridays for Future?

1 more reply

A_D_E_P_T7mo ago

It's hard to prove what you're asking because it's intrinsically not newsworthy -- whereas the reverse is. Surely if it's so bad in Germany, you should be able to dig up an example or two?

margalabargala7mo ago

> So I asked for proof that in other countries you can get away with breaking the government's rules.

Other countries like the way the US used to be 15 years ago? Is your argument really "other people don't have rights, therefore we shouldn't either"?

card_zero7mo ago

I agree that that was the opposite of proving a negative. The difficult thing would be demonstrating nobody ever did x.

hnfong7mo ago

Generally, I do agree that in most if not all places, if you get government funding, you can't go against government policy.

However, in this case, it's quite hard to argue that Terrence Tao had anything to do with antisemitism or anything against Trump's policies. Actually I don't think Terrence Tao did anything that Trump cared about. This isn't really a free speech issue, it's more like some fundamental instability in the US, and maybe the US government is running out on money and trying to cut down on research expenditure using excuses.

klooney7mo ago

Does AfD support qualify as forbidden speech?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

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A_D_E_P_T7mo ago

FirmwareBurnerOP7mo ago

Don't spin this around, what I asked you is not a negative.

People here argued that the US is fascist because in academia you can't get away with breaking governments rules getting you defunded and pointing at Germany for being superior in this regard.

So then I asked for proof that in other countries you can get away in academia with breaking the government's rules and not get defunded. It really is that simple.

davrosthedalek7mo ago

That's not what people have complained about. People complained about that in the US a government rule seems to be "don't criticize the government".

What about Christian Drosten who criticized a lot of the Corona decisions, Jan Boehmermann who is very critical but still employed by state-financed TV. Fridays for Future?

1 more reply

A_D_E_P_T7mo ago

It's hard to prove what you're asking because it's intrinsically not newsworthy -- whereas the reverse is. Surely if it's so bad in Germany, you should be able to dig up an example or two?

margalabargala7mo ago

> So I asked for proof that in other countries you can get away with breaking the government's rules.

Other countries like the way the US used to be 15 years ago? Is your argument really "other people don't have rights, therefore we shouldn't either"?

card_zero7mo ago

I agree that that was the opposite of proving a negative. The difficult thing would be demonstrating nobody ever did x.

hnfong7mo ago

Generally, I do agree that in most if not all places, if you get government funding, you can't go against government policy.

klooney7mo ago

Does AfD support qualify as forbidden speech?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse