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0 pointsamanaplanacanal9mo ago0 comments

They've already invaded twice. You are way more trusting than I am.

I mean, I get it. If you are a pacifist, you do you. Repeating Putin's talking points probably isn't going to convince anybody, though.

Obviously, Putin has visions of a greater empire. Perhaps you are just intentionally blind to that.

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pydry9mo ago

Yeah, they invaded twice and in each case a little diplomacy would have been sufficient to roll back the invasion. Diplomacy which was categorically refused for terrible reasons.

Hey, if you want to fight and die on behalf of your Western empire then Ukraine will be only too happy to have you and every Ukrainian of fighting age about to be thrown on to the front lines will be only too happy to trade places.

But, I get it - it's easy to treat little things like honest diplomacy and other countries' security concerns with complete disregard when you're not the one being thrown on to the front lines to die as a result of it. Only Ukrainians are forced to do that.

>Repeating Putin's talking points probably isn't going to convince anybody

Putin's a terrible human being and so are his supporters but he's not all that different to his western imperialist counterparts and the supporters of their narratives - people like you.

mopsi9mo ago

> Yeah, they invaded twice and in each case a little diplomacy would have been sufficient to roll back the invasion.

That's just a stalling tactic. The very people who built Russian diplomacy and personally mentored figures like the current foreign minister Lavrov have commented that Russia's offers have never been serious, pointing to details such as the fact that the people leading the negotiations are low-level functionaries without any authority to negotiate anything. You don't send errand boys if you're serious about negotiations.

pydry9mo ago

Diplomacy is always a murky world but in this case there is one and clear stand out example where what you said is true. It was announced that Minsk 2 was purely meant as a stalling tactic to allow re-armament.

Unfortunately for your little theory it was Ukraine and Angela Merkel who admitted this and not Russia.

This was made even more painfully obvious just before that day in Feb 2022 when Russia demanded Ukraine adhere to this multilateral (i.e. also agreed by Europe) agreement theyd already agreed to and Ukraine just point blank refused, preferring to fight.

Russian diplomacy follows a Clausewitzian model (i.e. that you're better off in tbe long run if you are up front about your intentions), unlike the western model where one day you announce talks with the Iranians pledging good faith in your negotiations and the next day you launch a surprise bombing raid, hoping this means you got 'em good.

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pydry9mo ago

Yeah, they invaded twice and in each case a little diplomacy would have been sufficient to roll back the invasion. Diplomacy which was categorically refused for terrible reasons.

>Repeating Putin's talking points probably isn't going to convince anybody

Putin's a terrible human being and so are his supporters but he's not all that different to his western imperialist counterparts and the supporters of their narratives - people like you.

mopsi9mo ago

> Yeah, they invaded twice and in each case a little diplomacy would have been sufficient to roll back the invasion.

pydry9mo ago

Unfortunately for your little theory it was Ukraine and Angela Merkel who admitted this and not Russia.

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