undefined | Better HN

0 pointsrunako10mo ago0 comments

> The US does not just send B2 bombers without knowing it's going to work.

I'm old enough to remember when we (the US) ran this exact playbook, except the last letter was 'q' instead of 'n'.

Spoiler: the B-2 played a part in both of the big wars we lost in the last couple of decades. The problem hinges on the definition of "work": yes, the bombs hit what they are aimed at. No, that does not result in operational success without a coherent theory of victory.

0 comments

abletonlive10mo ago

I'm old enough to remember that Iraq had its entire government toppled in about 3 weeks after the US invasion so this is not the example you think it is lol. You conveniently redefined what we are talking about. You must not remember saddam getting dragged through the streets.

runakoOP10mo ago

I do remember all of that.

What happened next? Did it go to plan? Nearly to plan? Close enough to plan that one could kind of squint and give partial credit? Worse than that?

Did the US lose more lives in Iraq (and kill more Iraqis) before or after "Mission Accomplished"?

abletonlive10mo ago

you don't have to squint to see reality.

saddam is gone and there was a regime change.

that's it. that's what we were talking about.

no need to go into other areas of the conversation that didn't exist before you came along to insert some reason why you feel justified defending a regime that oppresses women through a "morality police" force. i don't care why you think they should be allowed to have nukes. i'm sure you can argue for it all day. you don't need to get philosophical about what is "winning" or "working".

if you can't agree on objective reality and what we are discussing, we have nothing to discuss. move on

1 more reply

jjk16610mo ago

And I'm old enough to remember the previous war with Iraq which left Iraq's government intact, and the 12 years of no fly zone operations before attempt 2. I also remember attempt 2 costing around $3 Trillion.

fatbird10mo ago

I remember that being caused by a massive US ground invasion, not by sustained bombing. Has the US spent the last six months building up ground forces on Iran's borders?

mensetmanusman10mo ago

It only works if you think victory was hitting the target.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

abletonlive10mo ago

runakoOP10mo ago

I do remember all of that.

What happened next? Did it go to plan? Nearly to plan? Close enough to plan that one could kind of squint and give partial credit? Worse than that?

Did the US lose more lives in Iraq (and kill more Iraqis) before or after "Mission Accomplished"?

abletonlive10mo ago

you don't have to squint to see reality.

saddam is gone and there was a regime change.

that's it. that's what we were talking about.

if you can't agree on objective reality and what we are discussing, we have nothing to discuss. move on

1 more reply

jjk16610mo ago

fatbird10mo ago

I remember that being caused by a massive US ground invasion, not by sustained bombing. Has the US spent the last six months building up ground forces on Iran's borders?

mensetmanusman10mo ago

It only works if you think victory was hitting the target.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse