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0 pointsAlwaysRock1y ago0 comments

I think your definition is off from what most people would define AGI as. Generally, it means being able to think and reason at a human level for a multitude/all tasks or jobs.

"Artificial General Intelligence (AGI) refers to a theoretical form of artificial intelligence that possesses the ability to understand, learn, and apply knowledge across a wide range of tasks at a level comparable to that of a human being."

Altman says AGI could be here in 2025: https://youtu.be/xXCBz_8hM9w?si=F-vQXJgQvJKZH3fv

But he certainly means an LLM that can perform at/above human level in most tasks rather than a self aware entity.

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swatcoder1y ago

On the contrary, I think you're conflating the narrow jargon of the industry with what "most people" would define.

"Most people" naturally associate AGI with the sci-tropes of self-aware human-like agents.

But industries want something more concrete and prospectively-acheivable in their jargon, and so that's where AGI gets redefined as wide task suitability.

And while that's not an unreasonable definition in the context of the industry, it's one that vanishingly few people are actually familiar with.

And the commercial AI vendors benefit greatly from allowing those two usages to conflate in the minds of as many people as possible, as it lets them suggest grand claims while keeping a rhetorical "we obviously never meant that!" in their back pocket

famouswaffles1y ago

>But industries want something more concrete and prospectively-acheivable in their jargon, and so that's where AGI gets redefined as wide task suitability.

The term itself (AGI) in the industry has always been about wide task suitability. People may have added their ifs and buts over the years but that aspect of it never got 'redefined'. The earliest uses of the term all talk about how well a machine would be able to perform some set number of tasks at some threshold.

It's no wonder why. Terms like "consciousness" and "self-awareness" are completely useless. It's not about difficulty. It's that you can't do anything at all with those terms except argue around in circles.

nuancebydefault1y ago

There is no single definition, let alone a way to measure, of self awareness nor of reasoning.

Because of that, the discussion of what AGI means in its broadest sense, will never end.

So in fact such AGI discussion will not make nobody wiser.

nomel1y ago

I agree there's no single definition, but I think they all have something current LLM don't: the ability to learn new things, in a persistent way, with few shots.

I would argue that learning is The definition of AGI, since everything else comes naturally from that.

The current architectures can't learn without retraining, fine tuning is at the expense of general knowledge, and keeping things in context is detrimental to general performance. Once you have few shot learning, I think it's more of a "give it agency so it can explore" type problem.

Avshalom1y ago

Altman is marketing, he "certainly means" whatever he thinks his audience will buy.

nomel1y ago

> than a self aware entity.

What does this mean? If I have a blind, deaf, paralyzed person, who could only communicate through text, what would the signs be that they were self aware?

Is this more of a feedback loop problem? If I let the LLM run in a loop, and tell it it's talking to itself, would that be approaching "self aware"?

layer81y ago

Being aware of its own limitations, for example. Or being aware of how its utterances may come across to its interlocutor.

(And by limitations I don’t mean “sorry, I’m not allowed to help you with this dangerous/contentious topic”.)

nuancebydefault1y ago

There is no way of proving awareness in humans let alone machines. We do not even know whether awareness exists or it is just a word that people made up to describe some kind of feeling.

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nomel1y ago

> Or being aware of how its utterances may come across to its interlocutor.

I think this behavior is being somewhat demonstrated in newer models. I've seen GPT-3.5 175B correct itself mid response with, almost literally:

> <answer with flaw here>

> Wait, that's not right, that <reason for flaw>.

> <correct answer here>.

Later models seem to have much more awareness of, or "weight" towards, their own responses, while generating the response.

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revscat1y ago

Plenty of humans, unfortunately, are incapable of admitting limitations. Many years ago I had a coworker who believed he would never die. At first I thought he was joking, but he was in fact quite serious.

Then there are those who are simply narcissistic, and cannot and will not admit fault regardless of the evidence presented them.

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swatcoder1y ago

On the contrary, I think you're conflating the narrow jargon of the industry with what "most people" would define.

"Most people" naturally associate AGI with the sci-tropes of self-aware human-like agents.

But industries want something more concrete and prospectively-acheivable in their jargon, and so that's where AGI gets redefined as wide task suitability.

And while that's not an unreasonable definition in the context of the industry, it's one that vanishingly few people are actually familiar with.

famouswaffles1y ago

>But industries want something more concrete and prospectively-acheivable in their jargon, and so that's where AGI gets redefined as wide task suitability.

nuancebydefault1y ago

There is no single definition, let alone a way to measure, of self awareness nor of reasoning.

Because of that, the discussion of what AGI means in its broadest sense, will never end.

So in fact such AGI discussion will not make nobody wiser.

nomel1y ago

I agree there's no single definition, but I think they all have something current LLM don't: the ability to learn new things, in a persistent way, with few shots.

I would argue that learning is The definition of AGI, since everything else comes naturally from that.

Avshalom1y ago

Altman is marketing, he "certainly means" whatever he thinks his audience will buy.

nomel1y ago

> than a self aware entity.

What does this mean? If I have a blind, deaf, paralyzed person, who could only communicate through text, what would the signs be that they were self aware?

Is this more of a feedback loop problem? If I let the LLM run in a loop, and tell it it's talking to itself, would that be approaching "self aware"?

layer81y ago

Being aware of its own limitations, for example. Or being aware of how its utterances may come across to its interlocutor.

(And by limitations I don’t mean “sorry, I’m not allowed to help you with this dangerous/contentious topic”.)

nuancebydefault1y ago

There is no way of proving awareness in humans let alone machines. We do not even know whether awareness exists or it is just a word that people made up to describe some kind of feeling.

1 more reply

nomel1y ago

> Or being aware of how its utterances may come across to its interlocutor.

I think this behavior is being somewhat demonstrated in newer models. I've seen GPT-3.5 175B correct itself mid response with, almost literally:

> <answer with flaw here>

> Wait, that's not right, that <reason for flaw>.

> <correct answer here>.

Later models seem to have much more awareness of, or "weight" towards, their own responses, while generating the response.

1 more reply

revscat1y ago

Then there are those who are simply narcissistic, and cannot and will not admit fault regardless of the evidence presented them.

1 more reply

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