undefined | Better HN

0 pointsdeepsun1y ago0 comments

For low-level compiled system applications: Rust, Zig etc.

For compiled garbage-collected applications (web/cli): Go.

For high-level applications (web/cli/etl/desktop): Java, C#.

Also here is good writeup: https://hackernoon.com/the-real-c-killers-not-you-rust

discussed here two times:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34792932

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39770467

0 comments

ghosty1411y ago

I have a similar opinion: For low level stuff Rust or more "obscure" langs like Zig or Carbon offer a lot in that space. The moment you leave low-level I'd always go with C#/Java or TS for web-stuff. The productivity gains you get from switching from C++ to C# are absolutely insane.

neonsunset1y ago

Little reason to use Go here. C# is a much better language at allowing you to tactically write high-performance low-level code where it matters and relying on higher level abstractions when it's not (struct generics are just like in Rust allowing you to expend a little effort for achieving zero-cost abstractions, although not as convenient as just using objects everywhere).

Go is inadequate, poorly typed, has abysmal FFI overhead and bloated binary sizes as it does no metadata compression and other tricks C#'s AOT compilation does.

paulddraper1y ago

With Go, I can easily cross-compile a statically linked binary for each of the major platforms.

You cannot do that with C#.

posix_monad1y ago

Cross compilation story in C# is very good actually.

1 more reply

nickpp1y ago

But the fact that developers often need to be able to cover any one (or even multiple) of these areas, and that language proficiency (with platform APIs and various quirks) is quite hard to achieve - makes me think that the actual alternative is the elephant in the room, the one not even listed here: JavaScript.

deepsunOP1y ago

Having been programming continuously on JavaScript for over 20 with all the popular frameworks, I'd try to stay away from it as much as possible:

1. Dynamic typing must die. Except for R/Julia/Python (aka JuPyteR) notebooks use-case, where it's awesome. My list includes only statically-typed languages. Typescript is much better, but its type-checking still fails sometimes, unlike real static-typed languages.

2. NPM is a mess that allows any transitive dependency to run arbitrary code on your machine at a time of installation (including cleaning up after itself). Compare that to Java's Maven -- libs quality is much better. no arbitrary code runs, just downloading.

throwitaway11231y ago

> allows any transitive dependency to run arbitrary code on your machine at a time of installation

This point gets parroted so often on HN [1]. You can install packages with the --ignore-scripts flag to disable this behavior, or just set the option globally in your NPM config file. I do like the way Bun disables lifecycle scripts by default [2], but it takes me all of two seconds to run `npm config set ignore-scripts=true` on a new machine, so it's basically a non-issue for me.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38797176

[2] https://bun.sh/docs/cli/install#lifecycle-scripts

palata1y ago

Are you seriously mentioning JS as a C++ alternative? I am confused.

nickpp1y ago

I am old enough to remember when everything was written in C++, except embedded and OS kernels in C. Today even my chat, email client and IDE are written in JavaScript...

1 more reply

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

ghosty1411y ago

neonsunset1y ago

Go is inadequate, poorly typed, has abysmal FFI overhead and bloated binary sizes as it does no metadata compression and other tricks C#'s AOT compilation does.

paulddraper1y ago

With Go, I can easily cross-compile a statically linked binary for each of the major platforms.

You cannot do that with C#.

posix_monad1y ago

Cross compilation story in C# is very good actually.

1 more reply

nickpp1y ago

deepsunOP1y ago

Having been programming continuously on JavaScript for over 20 with all the popular frameworks, I'd try to stay away from it as much as possible:

throwitaway11231y ago

> allows any transitive dependency to run arbitrary code on your machine at a time of installation

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38797176

[2] https://bun.sh/docs/cli/install#lifecycle-scripts

palata1y ago

Are you seriously mentioning JS as a C++ alternative? I am confused.

nickpp1y ago

I am old enough to remember when everything was written in C++, except embedded and OS kernels in C. Today even my chat, email client and IDE are written in JavaScript...

1 more reply

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse