undefined | Better HN

0 pointspizza2343y ago0 comments

> I don't personally think it's realistic to expect everybody/all people (who mainly work for a living/work hard) to ask them to give up the luxury of spending their hard earned money on being able to transport themselves (to and from their job) in something other than the comfort of their own car

Societies don't need to ask citizens to choose a given mean of transport; they can route their choices them by making some means more convenient and other ones less.

Increasing car costs and reducing lanes/streets/parkings, while making the public transport more frequent/extensive/comfortable, will make citizens choose public transport (or more sustainable means) themselves.

On the other hand, when cities are developed (in certain cultures or at least areas) with private transport in mind, and it can be hard or impossible to redesign for public transport.

0 pointspizza2343y ago0 comments

Societies don't need to ask citizens to choose a given mean of transport; they can route their choices them by making some means more convenient and other ones less.

On the other hand, when cities are developed (in certain cultures or at least areas) with private transport in mind, and it can be hard or impossible to redesign for public transport.

0 comments

5 comments · 1 top-level

generalizations3y ago· 4 in thread

> Societies don't need to ask citizens to choose a given mean of transport; they can route their choices them by making some means more convenient and other ones less.

I'm reading that as, "we don't need to ask, we can just make them do it." Which to me is pretty arrogant.

sagarm3y ago

Society has made the choice so far to make owning a car as convenient and inexpensive as possible, while allocating almost no resources to other options. And no, usage fees including gas taxes don't cover the cost of roads -- let alone the land usage, externalities, and supporting infrastructure like drainage.

landemva3y ago

> Society has made

Big eu cities are expensive to park cars. Not inexpensive. Some cities such as Stockholm are banning commuter cars.

1 more reply

pizza234OP3y ago

> I'm reading that as, "we don't need to ask, we can just make them do it." Which to me is pretty arrogant.

It was never "asked" in first place; there was a large discussion on HN around the article about automakers driving the policies (https://www.vox.com/2015/1/15/7551873/jaywalking-history).

It's also not forcing anybody; it's a shift of conveniences. In a hypothetical situation with fantasy metrics, making a city 2x as comfortable for sustainable means (bikes, motorbikes, public transport) and 0.5x as comfortable for cars will not force anybody to use the former - people who love their time in the cars will still be able to.

(I stress that this applies to cities where logistics make a restructuring possible, which is not the case everywhere)

abenga3y ago

The US already "makes" commercial and residential building developers dedicate large proportions of their lots to meet minimum parking requirements in order to make it easier for people who want to drive do so. Is this "pretty arrogant" as well?

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse