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0 pointsrocket_surgeron3y ago0 comments

>Normally I can buy or sell something if:

>1. My government will allow me to transact 2. My bank will allow me to transact

Cryptobros keep saying this.

What kind of fantasy world do they live in where the government and banks "normally" approve or disapprove of cash transactions?

The bank from which you have withdrawn the cash does not know or care what you use it for, and the government may care but good luck it finding out.

Remember, bitcoin is DIGITAL CASH as per the first sentence of the bitcoin white paper so like for like should be compared: analog cash to digital cash.

You used the word "normally". I don't think "normally" means what you think it means.

Crypto is insane. Incomprehensible. The perfect merging of paranoiac libertarians and immoral grifters forming a feedback loop of destruction that grinds up and spits out the masses in order to enrich the few at a scale that traditional banking could only dream of. Executives at Goldman Sachs are looking at the people running off with cash at all of the cryptoscams, the margins of miners, with jealousy because "duh jackbooted gubmint" says they have to like, obey the law and stuff.

Crypto is a symptom of something being wrong with society but I don't know what.

I do know that everyone I know personally who has been into crypto has either been an immoral scammer... or an imbecile.

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4 comments · 2 top-level

salawat3y ago· 2 in thread

>What kind of fantasy world do they live in where the government and banks "normally" approve or disapprove of cash transactions?

Are you a United States Citizen?

If so, try writing a check a Russian oligarch, to pay for cuban cigars, or to sell something to Iran. Every last legal money emission in the United States includes a verification against the OFAC maintained Sanctioned Individuals List. Anything trying to leave one of those accounts will be rejected.

Any type of transaction falling afoul of country embargoes will also be denied. Again, put "Cuban meal" in a meno field, and prepare to get a call or ding from your financial institution to make sure they are not facilitating economic activity with Cuba, a crime they are strictly liable for.

Or be a Canadian protestor. Then have the Federal government order financial institutions to freeze your funds.

>The bank from which you have withdrawn the cash does not know or care what you use it for, and the government may care but good luck it finding out.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/us-banks-financial-institutions-s...

Wrong. Banks are most interested in what you use it for. If guns aren't your thing...

https://nypost.com/2022/09/06/sex-workers-say-wells-fargo-sh...

There's plenty more where that comes from.

Also, all financial institutions in the United States (money transmitters) by law must hold on to 7 years transaction history, and must have a dedicated process for integrating with and handling law enforcement requests. These are routine.

In short, your financial institution is an established component of law enforcement.

Keep in mind, I still think crypto is patently insane, but the cryptobros are absolutely correct in those senses.

...and Bitcoin is mot digital cash. Cash can be anonymous given sufficient effort. Bitcoin cannot.

rocket_surgeronOP3y ago

>If so, try writing a check a Russian oligarch, to pay for cuban cigars, or to sell something to Iran.

Which of those transactions is "normal"? It should be noted that even with cryptocurrencies laws still apply. You're still seeking "permission" for your "normal" transactions.

Here's the deal. The commentator said, effectively, it is NORMAL for "duh gubmint" to control your spending.

It is not.

Normal has a well-defined and commonly-accepted meaning. You cannot call bribing a Russian oligarch "normal" unless you are a different kind of person than most. Unless you are an abnormal person doing abnormal things.

There are edge cases where the government does regulate cash transactions and whether or not those edge cases are right or required is a separate discussion I am not having right now.

Also, checks aren't cash?????

>...and Bitcoin is mot digital cash.

The title of the bitcoin white paper is "Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System". Is it lying?

https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

To ape on Diderot, "Man will never be free until the last libertarian is strangled with the entails of the last cryptobro".

AbrahamParangi3y ago

I specifically said you cannot (except with cash, in-person) typically transact in ways that the government disallows. This is not relevant if all your transactions are of the sort that your government permits! This only matters when you and the government have a disagreement, which may be rare or which may be quite common depending on who you are and where you live.

Your emphasis is your own and does not reflect what I said, only what you imagine I said.

AbrahamParangi3y ago

Fine, add “or if you have and can transport sufficient cash and can meet face to face” to the first set of assumptions which doesn’t change the point at all.

This world, the one we live in, is one where the government and your bank - even in most rich and free countries - will not let you transact in certain ways or buy certain things. Perhaps that doesn’t matter to you! That’s okay! But it is how it is.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

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4 comments · 2 top-level

salawat3y ago· 2 in thread

>What kind of fantasy world do they live in where the government and banks "normally" approve or disapprove of cash transactions?

Are you a United States Citizen?

Or be a Canadian protestor. Then have the Federal government order financial institutions to freeze your funds.

>The bank from which you have withdrawn the cash does not know or care what you use it for, and the government may care but good luck it finding out.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/us-banks-financial-institutions-s...

Wrong. Banks are most interested in what you use it for. If guns aren't your thing...

https://nypost.com/2022/09/06/sex-workers-say-wells-fargo-sh...

There's plenty more where that comes from.

In short, your financial institution is an established component of law enforcement.

Keep in mind, I still think crypto is patently insane, but the cryptobros are absolutely correct in those senses.

...and Bitcoin is mot digital cash. Cash can be anonymous given sufficient effort. Bitcoin cannot.

rocket_surgeronOP3y ago

>If so, try writing a check a Russian oligarch, to pay for cuban cigars, or to sell something to Iran.

Which of those transactions is "normal"? It should be noted that even with cryptocurrencies laws still apply. You're still seeking "permission" for your "normal" transactions.

Here's the deal. The commentator said, effectively, it is NORMAL for "duh gubmint" to control your spending.

It is not.

There are edge cases where the government does regulate cash transactions and whether or not those edge cases are right or required is a separate discussion I am not having right now.

Also, checks aren't cash?????

>...and Bitcoin is mot digital cash.

The title of the bitcoin white paper is "Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System". Is it lying?

https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

To ape on Diderot, "Man will never be free until the last libertarian is strangled with the entails of the last cryptobro".

AbrahamParangi3y ago

Your emphasis is your own and does not reflect what I said, only what you imagine I said.

AbrahamParangi3y ago

Fine, add “or if you have and can transport sufficient cash and can meet face to face” to the first set of assumptions which doesn’t change the point at all.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse