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0 pointsgjsman-10003y ago0 comments

> Solar panels are cheap and batteries are easier to build and there are lots of ways of making them.

Right now they are, but they often rely on materials from politically unstable regions (particularly Africa), or potential political rivals (China). Also, many solar panels require polysilicon from China, which is almost certainly produced with forced labor.

https://www.csis.org/analysis/dark-spot-solar-energy-industr...

https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/04/12/clean-energy-china-xinj...

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/nov/29/evidence...

And it's not just a China problem.

"On batteries, there were major issues with the mining of between 15% and 30% of the world’s cobalt in the Democratic Republic of the Congo. Amnesty International found that children, some as young as seven, were working in artisanal cobalt mines, often for less than $2 a day. Mining conditions were reportedly hazardous, and workers often did not have adequate protective equipment and were exposed to toxic dust that contributed to hard metal lung disease."

The US is trying to crack down but Europe is lagging behind on it. However, if the report's claim (which I see no reason to doubt) that China has 82% of the global polysilicon market is true, with most of their polysilicon production being in the Xinjiang region, calling solar panels (or batteries) "cheap" is fairly distasteful considering their sources.

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2 comments · 2 top-level

rapsey3y ago

Mechanical, flow, heat, compressed air, pumped hydro are all types of batteries. All capable of storing MW to GW of power. It is not all lithium and cobalt.

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jillesvangurp3y ago

There are quite a few battery chemistries now that don't involve any cobalt. And the ones that do can get their cobalt from more reputable sources than the mining industries founded by colonial powers in Africa. (often backed by big oil and mining corporations). Cobalt and other minerals were mined long before lithium ion batteries came along, for example.

For all the crocodile tears about children mining cobalt, it's easy to forget how other industries can be just as bad or much worse. Of course, critics of batteries are laser focused on only and exclusively criticizing how bad things are when it comes to batteries and literally nothing else whatsoever.

I mean, do you want to talk about oil? Or coal? Or copper? Or uranium? Nasty industries, each of them. Especially oil. Lots of environmental destruction, poor working conditions, the occasional bit of genocide or sponsored corruption, wars, etc. Mining and oil/gas industry just are a nasty. Especially when everybody just accepts it as normal and looks the other way.

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