CDC flip-flopping on masks
CDC flip-flopping on how vaccine prevents spreads
Airplanes being the safest with high quality filters, yet they are the only place where masking is still required (which even the airlines disagree with)
CNN calling Ivermectin a horse dewormer, when Ivermectin has been administered to a large percentage of the global population
... the list goes on and on
*edit for formatting
The problem is people latched onto the idea of Ivermectin being beneficial, when the studies did not show that. So it was just fantasy. And people inevitably died because they thought they knew better than real doctors and decided to treat themselves with it.
The CDC needed to make decisions quickly at the beginning of the pandemic before anything about the disease was really understood. As they learned more information they changed those decisions. Did they do all of this perfectly? No. Did they fuck up at moments? Sure. Have aspects of their response been way too political? Yes. They're human and not perfect. They were working under insane conditions and made some mistakes.
At the same time that we were learning about the disease, it was also changing. The strains that are common now behave differently than the strains that existed two years ago. This also complicates the process.
You are criticizing the CDC for "flip-flopping" when they've simply responded to new information and a changing disease. Do you expect them to have known all they know now on Day 1 of the disease? Do you expect them to have said zero for several years until everything was 100% known? Whats your fucking point here?
The communication from the US government was terrible, especially compared to other countries who's health leaders don't assume their populace are idiots.
I call out flip-flopping as it reduces what little confidence the public has in their policy decisions and further empowers the fringe in discussions of ineffective treatments. No one is saying they should know on Day 1 of anything. That's a nonsense expectation. I do however expect them to communicate better and to educate the public on the evolution of the disease rather than rushing to any decisions until the data is clear.
I think the crazy picture of Joe Rogan is enough to indicate that this is probably not a piece with any sort of depth or nuance.
Nothing at all, as long as proper testing procedures are followed.
I don't think this is actually a widespread problem and I don't believe that the majority of the people who are "against" Ivermectin are somehow also against trying alternative therapeutics...
> CNN calling Ivermectin a horse dewormer
I'm actually curious because this is a very well coordinated and repeated talking point of the right: what does CNN calling Ivermectin a horse dewormer mean to you and why is that so significant?
If the individuals who have been peddling ivermectin and vitamin cocktails had instead encouraged enrollment in randomized controlled trials overseen by Institutional Review Boards to protect the rights and safety of human subjects, we would have quickly generated high quality data to determine safety and efficacy of ivermectin for COVID.
The haphazard global distribution of ivermectin meant that no meaningful data could be generated to determine if it worked.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisonbatemanhouse/2017/12/20/w...
The rest of your comments are distracting "whataboutisms" but to clarify:
• Airplanes may have good air circulation while the plane is flying but prior to take off and in airports, air circulation isn't so good.
• People were buying horse dewormer based on false claims about ivermectin. This is fact.
• As we learned more about the virus (e.g. the frequency of spread by asymptomatic individuals) and as the virus mutated (e.g. to be more infectious and not as "on target" for the vaccines), recommendations have changed.
The intent of my comment is to highlight the media's focus on one side of wrong decisions which only further divides the public.
* For airplanes, I am pointing out the requirement for masking currently even when masking is not required anywhere in California/New York (2 of the most restrictive states for COVID throughout the pandemic) for indoor. It's pure theatre to have people show up to the airport never wearing a mask and then putting it on (ineffectively no less) and then taking it off immediately when they leave the airport.
* Ivermectin is an anti-parasitic which has been prescribed 3.7 billion times (and won a nobel prize). Does it help with Covid? Current data seems to imply it does not. My callout is on the media calling its a horse dewormer (which while true is meant to mislead).
* On virus mutations, see my comment on flip-flopping.
You have to look at everything surrounding COVID in context. The most important context was that prior to COVID, Trump was obviously going to be re-elected. None of the world-ending catastrophes that everyone said would happen under him, did, in fact we got a lot of good out of his administration. The economy was great, taxes were low, gas prices were low, etc.
But then COVID happened, and finally, the opposition saw their opening. If they had any hope of Trump losing reelection, this was their only chance, and so every single day they did whatever they could to blame everything on Trump and only Trump, and did whatever they could to come to the defense of any organization or entity that Trump assigned blame to (WHO, China, etc.), and they also did whatever they could to trash anything that looked like it might help reduce the effects of the pandemic prior to the election.
People on a particular side of the aisle were "TERRIFIED" that the vaccine would be released before the election.
You'll recall, for example, that many of the people and organizations that shame everyone as "anti-vaxxers" for being wary of the vaccine, did that very same thing just prior to the election, spreading FUD (including Biden himself):
https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/01/health/eua-coronavirus-vaccin...
Ivermectin, a life-saving drug WHO-listed essential drug (found ineffective for most for COVID) that has a side-effect profile close to that of the antibiotics we as a country receive so many prescriptions of like candy, was referred to as "horse paste", and do you know why some idiots were resorting to getting the animal kind instead of the human kind? Because the media and the establishment treated this relatively harmless drug as something evil and so people who are inclined to believe everything is a conspiracy, had that further reinforced in their minds, so they did whatever they could to seek something that the establishment was actively trying to keep from them.
This a mixture of the state of the country Obama left him with and things that presidents and their admin don't have much influence over.
Do you actually think Biden increased gas prices as if the effects of the pandemic and war (that trump likely helped cause by his deference to putin and hostility towards nato) aren't the actual causes?
Trump threw out the pandemic playbook.
Trump and the GOP's raised taxes on a substantial number of middle class and lower income people. Some of it was immediately and some of those increases were left as timebombs.
I really could go on and on, but that will turn in to arguing on the internet. But that statement on how "good" trump's admin suggests extremely rose colored glasses on what actually went on.
The vaccine prevented spread amazingly well, assuming the mRNA one and original strain. This changed several strains later. Even when the vaccine actually did an excellent job of preventing spread entirely the US still did not get anywhere near enough vaccination, or even halfway. Most vaccines need something like 90%+ uptake for actual herd immunity, including refreshing when they wear off to maintain it - across the entire population, not just 90%+ of adults. IIRC, measles starts community spreading again when it dips below the mid to high 90s - none of this is new, but the US/CDC somehow treated it like "wow we have reached almost halfway (if you ignore more than half the population that isn't eligible but can still spread it!), what a success".
Masks work excellently when worn by everyone properly (or N95-equivalent+ when worn by one side). Masks do not work when people take them off all the time and pretend to have a water bottle. Bandanas do not work well. Gaiters do not work well.
I also frequently saw some really ridiculous "outdoor dining" where it was tents or bubbles sealed on all ends, with circulated air/heating. That is not outdoor dining, and is pointless if you are trying to reduce spread.
Pretty much all my (APAC-team, most also been through SARS) coworkers were incredibly confused as to why the US/CDC thought the virus was not permitted to infect you if you were actively eating or drinking. Indoor dining and chatter permitted during peak spread while you only had to put on a mask when you got up? What is the point?
Almost every time I see someone wearing even a surgical mask in US imagery, the nosepiece was not pushed down to form a better seal, it's below their nose, or some other form of inanity while complaining how they don't work. One of the worst things is when someone is in an enclosed area and keeps their mask off while exhaling continuously, only putting it on when someone comes in. At that point you already have a full room of aerosol. When everyone does something horrifically wrong, ignoring all guidelines and instructions, then says x doesn't work and is pointless, that is not x's fault.
There is also the whole "you should stay at home and not go to large social events BUT you can go to work that usually has more people than a friend's place, also no sick pay, also no time off" that is another can of worms.
Sorry revisionist historians, the vaccine does not and never has prevented transmission of COVID. You still get infected by, get sick from and can spread the virus. Simply read the documentation from the Pfizer or Moderna mRNA clinical trials to see the claimed benefit spelled out.
The media endlessly bleating "93% effective!" was in reference to preventing serious illness, which is the only benefit it offers.
That use of the word immunity was attempted, sure. But had to be changed to “protection” as it doesn’t actually prevent infection nor stop the spread. Hence, no herd immunity.
What I learned from the anti-vaxxer on Facebook is that when they say "mask does not work" they mean "the government guideline does not work".
Like you said it need to be cultural and people need to genuinely try to use mask correctly not just because its the rule.
It's that the huge amount of misinformation caused people to get the horse version instead of asking a doctor for the version designed for human.
Its basically uneducated peoples trying to self prescribe because they think they know better than a doctor that spent 14 year in school and had GPA of 3.5+.
The earlier the better of course, just like Tamiflu. The best results were attained when Ivermectin was used as a prophylactic.
>Ivermectin doesn’t reduce mortality in COVID a significant amount (let’s say d > 0.3) in the absence of comorbid parasites: 85-90% confidence
> As we’ve previously discussed, IVM Meta has some curious traits: it resolves to the same IP address as hcqmeta.com as well as c19legacy.com. HCQMeta uses the same kind of purported real time meta analysis to recommend for the use of hydroxychloroquine. C19 legacy has claimed to count the “unnecessary” deaths caused by doctors not using hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin to treat COVID-19. All of these sites refer physicians to the FLCCC for “treatment protocols” and also promote the World Council for Health, a faux public health consortium that’s made up solely of ivermectin advocacy groups.
This is contrary to WHO guidance in which the risk of heart problems outweigh the minor benefit of maybe not being hospitalized from contracting a strain of COVID-19 (delta) which has been eradicated thanks to the weaksauce omicron variant.
That is chaos.
The science is literally _years_ behind on this, and it's clearer than ever that Pfizer and Moderna are trying to rake in as much $$$ as their FDA friends will allow them to.
First, do no harm.
If you're choosing to go after Joe Rogan and none of the proponents of the other points above, it seems fairly obvious that you're ideologically motivated in your attack.
This makes sense because it is known that intestinal worms can compromise the immune system.
https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/ivermectin-much-more-t...
Grifting hypocrites, the lot of them.
Let's assume that Ivermectin is completely useless, not only against Covid-19 but other things that make Covid-19 more dangerous.
How do you get from there to an official campaign against it? Someone who takes Ivermectin on their nickel doesn't stop anyone from producing or distributing something that does work.
Then Covid happened, and I discovered that movie was so accurate that I'm not sure I have the stomach to watch it again.
