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0 pointshn_throwaway_995y ago0 comments

Taken to it's conclusion, the world becomes a pretty scary place when things are determined by just what is "fair". At the end of the day the author's argument boils down to "Google is very rich, I'm not, I should be able to sidestep their demands for payment on their service." Given an exactly equivalent analogy, if you put your house up on AirBnB would anyone be surprised if AirBnB cracks down on people paying outside their platform and instead guiding renters to a separate "donation page"?

0 comments

12 comments · 4 top-level

coding1235y ago· 7 in thread

Let's make the world more fair first before locking everyone into the play store or the apple store. With the airbnb analogy, people are also free to list their vacation house on reddit, craigslist or just tell people about it and as long as they have a method to take payment - that just works.

Let's simplify. Let's say I sell lemonade. It's 100% legit with USDA approval or whatever BUT I'm having trouble selling it. Grocery stores are happy with their own brand but maybe I'm lucky enough to get 1 Wholefoods to set up a counter. I can see the analogy of whole foods requiring me to not sell while in their store. However whole foods does NOT require me to white label. And they would not require me to change my website to not have alternative buying choices. In fact I do this all the time with foods I find in Wholefoods - I go to the website of foods I love and see if I can buy directly in bulk.

This is the CORRECT analogy. It's not correct to say that everyone is going into Safeway and stealing shit off the shelves. The OP should know that, and you should know that.

themacguffinman5y ago

> With the airbnb analogy, people are also free to list their vacation house on reddit, craigslist or just tell people about it and as long as they have a method to take payment - that just works.

And on Android, developers are free to list their apps on F-Droid, Amazon Appstore or just let people download & install it from their own website. Unlike iOS, the Play Store is not mandatory.

> However whole foods does NOT require me to white label. (...) And they would not require me to change my website to not have alternative buying choices.

Grocery stores can and do ask anything they want of suppliers. Trader Joe's buys many products from suppliers like PepsiCo under a white labelling agreement. Walmart will fully dictate the packaging and pricing of your product (eg. demanding that Vlasic sell a Walmart-exclusive $2.97 gallon jar of pickles). Don't like their terms? Tough luck, it's their store.

I'm not saying that the grocery store analogy is a good one but it clearly works against your point. Actually I've only seen it mentioned to support dictatorial app stores.

anoncake5y ago

> And on Android, developers are free to list their apps on F-Droid, Amazon Appstore or just let people download & install it from their own website. Unlike iOS, the Play Store is not mandatory.

In practice, it is. Only the Play Store can update apps in the background.

hn_throwaway_99OP5y ago

I can't downvote you because you're a direct response, but please don't do this:

> Downvotes are not replying so I'm assuming they are just pissed that my logic checks out.

It breaks the site guidelines [1].

[1] Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading.

coding1235y ago

Thank you, noted and removed.

spoonjim5y ago

Trader Joe’s, on the other hand, does require almost everyone to white label.

kentonv5y ago

Trader Joe's customers can and do shop at other stores as well. Whereas people don't realistically carry more than one phone or switch phone types frequently.

coding1235y ago

Trader Joes has what, 1% of the market share of shoppers? Android and iPhone have what, 99%?

2 more replies

mitchdoogle5y ago· 1 in thread

It surprises me when anyone defends these companies. I mean, come on, they really don't need your help. It's like cheering for the Empire in Star Wars, because they are "well within their rights to build a planet size spaceship with capabilities of destroying planets"

root_axis5y ago

This is a really tortured analogy. Google isn't building a doomsday weapon, it's a mobile app distribution platform for what is almost entirely composed of trivial time-wasters. Believe it or not, some people base their reasoning on principles rather than the topic of discussion's perceived reputation.

kentonv5y ago

No one is arguing we should abandon rule of law for some abstract notion of "fairness". We're having a public debate about whether this behavior is fair. If we decide it isn't, then the next step is legislation to correct the problem (or Google doing so voluntarily). No one is going to directly enforce an ambiguous notion of fairness on Google.

solosoyokaze5y ago

As a consumer or developer, your interests are aligned with the author's. Unless you work for Google, you'd be better off fighting policies like this.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse

0 comments

12 comments · 4 top-level

coding1235y ago· 7 in thread

This is the CORRECT analogy. It's not correct to say that everyone is going into Safeway and stealing shit off the shelves. The OP should know that, and you should know that.

themacguffinman5y ago

> With the airbnb analogy, people are also free to list their vacation house on reddit, craigslist or just tell people about it and as long as they have a method to take payment - that just works.

And on Android, developers are free to list their apps on F-Droid, Amazon Appstore or just let people download & install it from their own website. Unlike iOS, the Play Store is not mandatory.

> However whole foods does NOT require me to white label. (...) And they would not require me to change my website to not have alternative buying choices.

I'm not saying that the grocery store analogy is a good one but it clearly works against your point. Actually I've only seen it mentioned to support dictatorial app stores.

anoncake5y ago

> And on Android, developers are free to list their apps on F-Droid, Amazon Appstore or just let people download & install it from their own website. Unlike iOS, the Play Store is not mandatory.

In practice, it is. Only the Play Store can update apps in the background.

hn_throwaway_99OP5y ago

I can't downvote you because you're a direct response, but please don't do this:

> Downvotes are not replying so I'm assuming they are just pissed that my logic checks out.

It breaks the site guidelines [1].

[1] Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading.

coding1235y ago

Thank you, noted and removed.

spoonjim5y ago

Trader Joe’s, on the other hand, does require almost everyone to white label.

kentonv5y ago

Trader Joe's customers can and do shop at other stores as well. Whereas people don't realistically carry more than one phone or switch phone types frequently.

coding1235y ago

Trader Joes has what, 1% of the market share of shoppers? Android and iPhone have what, 99%?

2 more replies

mitchdoogle5y ago· 1 in thread

root_axis5y ago

kentonv5y ago

solosoyokaze5y ago

As a consumer or developer, your interests are aligned with the author's. Unless you work for Google, you'd be better off fighting policies like this.

j / k navigate · click thread line to collapse