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0 pointsnewacct5835y ago0 comments

How exactly do you define sacking?

They pushed past armed guards, broke barriers, entered the chambers of an active joint session of congress forcing the entirety of the USA legislative branch and its Vice President at the very moment they were certifying a presidential election into a secure bunker.

... and you think that's "about as peaceful an outcome as we could possibly have hoped for"?

I genuinely don't understand. This is the kind of operation of government that is supposed to never be disruptible. If past mobs knew it was this easy then we could have had a zillion coups by now.

You're saying they weren't murderers I guess? That they didn't blow up the building or take hostages (though there is footage of a guy with zip ties that looks like he wanted to)? I mean, yeah, that would be worse. This is still unimaginably bad.

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awnird5y ago

The insurrectionists were murderers though.

https://twitter.com/kristin__wilson/status/13473283250191646...

incrudible5y ago

> How exactly do you define sacking?

I'll go with this one, from Cambridge Dictionary:

"an attack on a building or town in which a lot of destruction is caused and many valuable things are stolen"

> ... and you think that's "about as peaceful an outcome as we could possibly have hoped for"?

Yes, as peaceful as we could have hoped for, considering that many of these people believe a satanic cult has undermined the US government and defrauded their rightful president out of a second term.

> I genuinely don't understand. This is the kind of operation of government that is supposed to never be disruptible. If past mobs knew it was this easy then we could have had a zillion coups by now.

You don't automatically achieve a coup by entering some building and interrupting some bureaucratic process, no matter how symbolic it may be. Biden got elected.

> This is still unimaginably bad.

You must lack imagination.

newacct583OP5y ago

Just to take this one bit:

> You don't automatically achieve a coup by entering some building and interrupting some bureaucratic process

Sorry, but that's EXACTLY how coups work in the real world. You disrupt the government in such a way that the rule of law fails. In fact, it's been reported that at least one Trump goal was to push certification out beyond the 11 day (I think, details are fuzzy) deadline in the electoral count act and force the house to decide.

You're simply saying that it didn't work. But that's down as much to luck (a smallish crowd and multiple barriers to cross) and architecture (cold war escape tunnels) as it is to anything fundamental. It is VERY easy to imagine an alternate universe where Pelosi and Pence are still being held hostage right now.

incrudible5y ago

> Sorry, but that's EXACTLY how coups work in the real world. You disrupt the government in such a way that the rule of law fails.

Come on. Rule of law doesn't stop working just because a couple of politicians don't get to sign papers on schedule. If it was that easy, the country wouldn't last a month without a successful coup.

> In fact, it's been reported that at least one Trump goal was to push certification out beyond the 11 day (I think, details are fuzzy) deadline in the electoral count act and force the house to decide.

I'd think the supreme court would have to decide if that's constitutional. If it is, then it's a crazy legal loophole and Trump would just be the first to exploit it.

> You're simply saying that it didn't work.

No. I'm saying that this "insurrection" is being blown out of proportion. Biden is elected. Trump has called his goons home.

> It is VERY easy to imagine an alternate universe where Pelosi and Pence are still being held hostage right now.

Sure, but moving forward, should we judge these people by what one might imagine could have happened, not what actually happened? I don't think so.

newacct583OP5y ago

> If it is, then it's a crazy legal loophole and Trump would just be the first to exploit it.

Sorry (and apologies to Godwin but this is legitimate) but Hitler taking power in 1933 was through a "crazy legal loophole" too. Just stop it. Take it seriously. This was a failed coup, but still a coup. Historically, failed coups (c.f. Hitler in 1923) often get repeated, successfully.

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awnird5y ago

The insurrectionists were murderers though.

https://twitter.com/kristin__wilson/status/13473283250191646...

incrudible5y ago

> How exactly do you define sacking?

I'll go with this one, from Cambridge Dictionary:

"an attack on a building or town in which a lot of destruction is caused and many valuable things are stolen"

> ... and you think that's "about as peaceful an outcome as we could possibly have hoped for"?

Yes, as peaceful as we could have hoped for, considering that many of these people believe a satanic cult has undermined the US government and defrauded their rightful president out of a second term.

> I genuinely don't understand. This is the kind of operation of government that is supposed to never be disruptible. If past mobs knew it was this easy then we could have had a zillion coups by now.

You don't automatically achieve a coup by entering some building and interrupting some bureaucratic process, no matter how symbolic it may be. Biden got elected.

> This is still unimaginably bad.

You must lack imagination.

newacct583OP5y ago

Just to take this one bit:

> You don't automatically achieve a coup by entering some building and interrupting some bureaucratic process

incrudible5y ago

> Sorry, but that's EXACTLY how coups work in the real world. You disrupt the government in such a way that the rule of law fails.

Come on. Rule of law doesn't stop working just because a couple of politicians don't get to sign papers on schedule. If it was that easy, the country wouldn't last a month without a successful coup.

I'd think the supreme court would have to decide if that's constitutional. If it is, then it's a crazy legal loophole and Trump would just be the first to exploit it.

> You're simply saying that it didn't work.

No. I'm saying that this "insurrection" is being blown out of proportion. Biden is elected. Trump has called his goons home.

> It is VERY easy to imagine an alternate universe where Pelosi and Pence are still being held hostage right now.

Sure, but moving forward, should we judge these people by what one might imagine could have happened, not what actually happened? I don't think so.

newacct583OP5y ago

> If it is, then it's a crazy legal loophole and Trump would just be the first to exploit it.

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