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0 pointsadamrezich9y ago0 comments

This has been my exact experience. I just had a week of phone calls and emails about a very promising, well-paying frontend job opportunity. All of them were with no-technical-knowledge buzzwordy HR types who were very friendly and assured me that my resume and portfolio were great, and that I would be a good fit for the job. The whole thing ended with a phone call that went something like:

"Hi, so, your resume says you have nine months of experience?"

"Well yes, but I have countless personal projects under my belt, I designed and built game engines with teams of students..."

"Yes, but this position requires four years of professional experience."

"Well I still think I'd be a great fit for your company, I have experience with the specific technology stack you use, you can ask my previous employer..."

"Yes, but this position requires four years of experience, so, I'm sorry, but you don't meet the qualifications."

"Oh. Okay, thanks, bye."

Another story:

I got a call about a job I'd applied to. The guy on the phone said I looked like a promising candidate, but my resume didn't list the start and end dates of my previous job (nine months total), as I'd accidentally sent an old version of my resume. I emailed the correct version of my resume, and nearly immediately got an email back, saying, and I quote:

"Needed 1+Years of Experience so if you can change the duration time"

After a few minutes of consideration, I edited my resume to change the end date of my previous job to be one year from the start date, saved it as a separate copy, attached it, and sent it back. The guy immediately replied asking me to verify that the 50k starting salary would work for me. (Before anyone says 50k is too low, rent is due and I'm desperate.) This was just last week and I haven't heard back since but this is the most promising opportunity I've been able to find after months of searching.

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The thing is, I don't even want to do frontend web development. I want to work in game development, but apparently to get a start doing that professionally, I need professional programming experience on my resume to look good because those positions are so competitive. Okay, fine, I can do web development, front- or backend, I thought. That'll be great for padding out my resume, and, y'know, paying rent. But it turns out that landing one of these jobs is also really difficult!

What frustrates me about all of this is not so much my own position, but about the future of the industry. As time goes on, I think we're going to see more and more people take the path I took of learning stuff on their own instead of at college. Formal CS education is far from useless, but if this stuff's all available for free online, people are going to download it, play around with it, and learn how to use it... it just seems crazy to me that companies are hiring just-out-of-college CS graduates over people who have made a ton of stuff on their own over the years.

0 comments

noxToken9y ago

Two things:

All of them were with no-technical-knowledge buzzwordy HR types who were very friendly and assured me that my resume and portfolio were great

I don't inherently agree that this is how it should be. I do understand that businesses want to minimize risks (don't hire bad employees for 6 months) while saving time (don't interview them in the first place). One of the easiest ways to achieve the latter is by having minimum requirements.

The rebuttal to that is always having a good interview process that measures the candidate on a personal level while also getting a feel for their technical prowess. This is another problem. Some people think all-day interviews are perfect for this. Others want to show up for an hour or two, white board something relevant, and call it a day. Some want take home project. Others demand that potential employers pay them if they're so keen on giving a take home project.

I don't think there is a silver bullet. I think there are objectively better ways than other when evaluating talent such as being flexible. For example, a new graduate will almost never have 2 years of professional experience. A new graduate may have an impressive GitHub profile filled with completed, demo-able projects alongside contributions to other people's projects. While not a direct substitute, this is a damn good indicator.

No one can seem to agree on the entire process though, so we're stuck with HR Henry and his checklist.

(Before anyone says 50k is too low, rent is due and I'm desperate.)

Depending on your location, $50k can be plenty, Where I live, $50k is great salary for a single person. Also, pay isn't the only thing that makes a job worthwhile. My starting salary was competitive, but definitely at the lower end. The work/life balance, however, came slightly before salary.

ryanbrunner9y ago

Speaking as someone who has been the one hiring devs for about 8 years now, I think you need to take a bit of control of the hiring / interview process, because you're not going to make many inroads if you go by their playbook. Companies are getting wary of front end developers without much professional experience since there tends to be a pretty massive talent differential, and no real easy way to judge who's capable.

Find a way to speak directly to someone in engineering - preferably someone who is doing the hiring. If you can meet someone in person at a meetup that's best, but e-mail works otherwise. Offer to do a project for them to demonstrate your skills. Almost every company is going to have something that's not on the critical path that they could use help with. You should get paid for this - try to figure out what freelancers make in your market and price within it, but on the low end (don't try to undercut the entire market).

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