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0 pointsPxtl10y ago0 comments

Dotalikes (I refuse to use the term mobas) are a great study in unintended consequences. The game has strong RPG elements because those are fun... but that creates a vicious cycle where winners win more. The game has defenses that are tough so that the losing teams can hang on... but those prolong a one-sided game. And the RPG elements mean you can't just let players drop and come back like an fps game, so you're committed for the entire round.

Now add in its RTS roots - an overhead God's eye view lets you watch your teammates. RPG elements means a bad player isn't merely useless, but he's actually feeding power to your opponents.

So a long game, with a prolonged endgame that often results in 10+ minutes of moribund gameplay after the match is prettymuch already decided, without even the dignity of a quick execution like an rts generally provides. No leaving allowed, either. And you get to watch your teammate (you only have 4) who brought this fate on your head, and you're stuck together for the whole round.

They couldn't have designed a game that makes you hate your weakest teammate more if they tried.

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waterhouse10y ago· 4 in thread

This sounds quite interesting. In chess, most grandmaster-level games are resolved by a resignation or draw agreement; rarely does it reach checkmate, stalemate, threefold repetition, or a 50-move-rule draw. I'd expect a similar solution for any other game that has a long "slowly and surely crush your opponent" ending period.

You say players aren't allowed to leave? No one can prevent someone from quitting the application or shutting down their computer. But I'm guessing that the service won't let you join a different game until the current one finishes...

Is there a way for a team to resign? Surely if a team unanimously thinks they've lost, they can surrender immediately...?

vbezhenar10y ago

About Heroes of the Storm: players aren't allowed to leave and if they do, they are threatened to be queued with other leavers. And there's no resign option.

On the other hand, my worst experience with Dota was that a lot of players were leavers, so any sign of losing and someone left the game. And after that it's really game over. No fun to lose the game this way, even no fun to win the game this way. But with HOTS that's completely different. Almost everyone tries to stay until the defeat and it's not that rare to see a comeback and victory.

So I'm supporting that notion of not allowing anyone just to leave. It's not a chess and there are other players who might want to fight until the end. On the other hand, quick anonymous poll, initiated by one player, if anyone wants to stay, and defeat if everyone wants to resign wouldn't hurt anyone, I guess.

bojo10y ago

The system penalizes you for leaving in the middle of the game, to the point where if you do it often enough you can get your account banned.

Your team can resign, but it requires at least a 4/1 vote. You typically end up with that one try-hard player who refuses to end with dignity and get 3/2 non-resigns, forcing everyone to play out a lost game.

On top of that if you afk or troll yourself there is a reporting feature at the end of the game where you can flag players, which can also result in account suspensions and bans if they occur too often.

It really is a terrible system all the way through.

mjevans10y ago

It sounds like a sufficient mechanism would be to have the following options:

* A simple majority vote for designating a player 'too weak for this level of play'.

* A strong majority vote (>75%; in a team of 5 this would be 4+) for designating a player 'a troll'.

* Either of the above ejecting the player from the team at that instant.

* Allowing all other votes to proceed as normal (N-1 required to resign a match).

mashlol10y ago

A team can surrender if 4/5 teammates agree and at least 20 minutes have passed in the game. Players often believe the game is over before 20 minutes though, which causes these problems.

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